Showing posts with label taoism. Show all posts
Showing posts with label taoism. Show all posts

19 July 2007

Café Taoism, the high C of faith

Arr, flamewar! PZ Myers at the epicenter, almost as a matter of course. A familiar argument in the reaction from Mark Kleiman of samefacts.com seems instructive:

Religious thought, writing, and speech, at its adult level, is always metaphorical. "Humans are created in the Image of God," taken literally, is nonsense, if you remember that it is a part of a religious tradition that says that God is an infinite, omniscient, beneficent, immortal being "without parts or passions," which is the opposite of finite, finitely rational, ethically challenged mortal beings with physical bodies and emotional drives. It makes no more sense as a proposition in comparative primatology than "My love is like a red, red rose" makes sense as a proposition in botany. But it's a very powerful metaphor for the ethical proposition "Human beings are not to be damaged or degraded." (Of course religious writers don't generally assert that "God" names a metaphor rather than an entity, any more than the actor playing Hamlet looks at the audience and says, "I'm not really the Prince of Denmark" or any more than a Pynchon novel carries a disclaimer on the title page, "None of this stuff really happened.")

[...] But if, like anyone who has thought deeply about these matters, you think of God as an especially potent metaphor (or, to put in more flowery terms, "a mystery to be understood only in part, and then by faith") — if you think that, then the whole debate is pointless. Both Gerson and Meyers are just being silly: it's two blind men debating the nature of the elephant while groping around different parts of a Land Rover.


Like anyone who has thought deeply about these matters. Anyone truly reasonable couldn't possibly disagree with me, after all, because I am the very epitome of reason. I like the comparison with fiction, though.

At its adult level. What is this adult level? Well, from his redux, fresh today:

[...] So, for me, "that which alone is wise and good" does not allow itself to be called "Zeus," or by any other name. ("The name that can be named is not the Eternal Name," says Lao-tse.)


Ah, so the adult level of religion is a kind of café Taoism. Thanks for clearing that up.

How would we know when someone is on this adult level, though? After all, labels for belief merrily conflate the "childish" and "adult" versions. The adult version being the "properly understood" one, by Kleimannic decree, you'd think it'd be the highest priority of churches to make sure their followers are believing properly. Maybe it'd make for a lot less grief if believers could wear little badges saying I am not a literalist; you may address me like an adult.

I see now it's a "criticism of his theological tone-deafness." Clearly that means café taoism is like the highest overtones of the basic belief that carries the chord, and I'm mistaken for focusing on the bass that resounds every way I turn.

25 October 2006

Imaginary relationships

In the Metafilter comments on Terry Eagleton commenting on Dawkins' The God Delusion (Eagleton quoted in italics):

"It is rather to claim that while faith, rather like love, must involve factual knowledge, it is not reducible to it. For my claim to love you to be coherent, I must be able to explain what it is about you that justifies it; but my bank manager might agree with my dewy-eyed description of you without being in love with you himself."

You know, this actually explains a lot. People are in love with the idea of God. Literally. So no matter what God says, no matter how evil the commands from the organization or the little voice in your head become, you mostly just DO them, because you love him/her/it.

Hmph, I'd never thought about it this way before. A large chunk of the world (half, maybe?) would appear to be in an abusive relationship with an imaginary being.
posted by Malor at 1:00 AM PST on October 25


That comment is brilliant, in a slightly similar way to this TMCM strip.

Interestingly, Terry Eagleton himself seems to be the sort of Christian who's gone more than half the way to Taoism:

Theologians do not believe that he is either inside or outside the universe, as Dawkins thinks they do. His transcendence and invisibility are part of what he is, which is not the case with the Loch Ness monster. [...] He is, rather, the condition of possibility of any entity whatsoever, including ourselves.

...would that be all theologians, or just the subset of them that happen to agree with you, Dr. Eagleton?

(Of course, any truly sensible person wouldn't disagree with me, because I cannot possibly be wrong.)